A year of significant transition
Dec 18, 11:14 PM | Harry Reid
In recent months, a very serious debate about the president’s policy in Iraq has taken place in our country. During this time, the president has reached out and spoken more directly than ever before about how we went to war and why it is important to achieve victory, a goal we all share.
While I appreciate the president’s increased candor, too much of the substance remains the same and the American people have still not heard what benchmarks we must meet along the way to know that progress is being made and that our brave troops can begin to come home. As the New Year approaches and the Iraqi people begin to form a new government, the president must provide his leadership in order to make next year a year of significant transition.
Comment
- Democrats,
Please keep drinking the Koolaid. While your sorry, conspiracy theory asses, keep losing elections.
Maybe because you can’t face the facts. The American public grew tired of 40 years of Democrat’s control of government. A new era is upon us, like it or not.Your party has no plan
for our country. Everything the President does is wrong to you . The majority according to the last election think otherwise. You could keep all your polling data. The only poll that matters is every four years when we elect a new President.
If your party had any balls, they would try to impeach him for what the press has reported about surveillance of so called Americans. Then we would find out how much Harry Reid and Nancy Polisi knew and why they did not go public with it, as outraged as they claim to be now. Maybe they could be indicted as a co-conspirators.
Please try to come to your senses. We are at war with an enemy that will kill as many Americans as they can. They don’t wear military uniforms.Some may live in our country. Your party is aiding and abetting them.
Harry Reid should know better, he supposedly represents me, I live in Las Vegas, Nv., we were identified in the Detroit terror cell trial as a prime target.Home movies were recovered of our hotels. Harry should be right up front and want all the intelligence information possible.Stop trying to gain a political advantage at the risk of my safety
— the gop won get over it Dec 18, 11:47 PM # - Harry, I was about to commend you and then the second paragraph showed up. Comment #1 says it all! Unless you and those of your ilk grow some cojones (that’s Spanish) and start supporting your constituents the demmies will never be in power.
— Kee Dec 19, 12:22 AM # - ***“In recent months, a very serious debate about the president’s policy in Iraq has taken place in our country.”***
Recent months??? You must have missed noticing the millions that protested prior to the invasion, and the Generals that advised against it and were consequently demoted or retired. When are you and your cohorts going to start telling the truth, Harry?
***“During this time, the president has reached out and spoken more directly than ever before about how we went to war and why it is important to achieve victory, a goal we all share.”***
Really? Thats GREAT news! Coupled with Cheney’s assertion that the insurgency is “in its last throes” then we can now rest assured that everything is just jim dandy and these bastards have stopped lying to us.
BTW, Reid,what the hell is “victory”??? Care to define it for us??? Does it mean the same thing as “mission accomplished”?
***“While I appreciate the president’s increased candor…..”***
Who cares about you “appreciating his candor” when the lying treasonous puke is illegally spying on American citizens. Do you “appreciate” that too?
***”..... too much of the substance remains the same and the American people have still not heard what benchmarks we must meet along the way to know that progress is being made and that our brave troops can begin to come home. As the New Year approaches and the Iraqi people begin to form a new government, the president must provide his leadership in order to make next year a year of significant transition.”***
The rest of your statement is just chickenshit say nothing political fluff, so I won’t comment on it.
Harry, where the hell is Phase Two?
And what do you intend to do about Bush’s flagrant disregard for the law and our constitution?
So…reread this post Harry. I pose three simple questions for you….
1)WHAT exactly is “victory” in Iraq?
2)Where the hell is phase two???
3)What do you intend to do about Bush’s criminal act of spying on American citizens?
Do you have the balls to answer them, or can I expect the same kind of response from you that Bush has given to Cindy Sheehan???
The people that pay your wages would like to know.
— Pissed Off American Dec 19, 12:25 AM # - Please try to come to your senses. We are at war with an enemy that will kill as many Americans as they can.
the gop won get over it Dec 18, 11:47 PM
Well said, tgwgoi. There are only two options in the war on terror. Side with the terrorists who will kill us, or side with the GOP who will kill our country.
How about we all just follow Bush over a cliff and end it quickly?
— Horkus Dec 19, 12:29 AM # - #1 – “conspiracy theory asses” Well smart ass, apparently you haven’t read the writing of your own anti-American heroes:
http://www.newamericancentury.org/iraqclintonletter.htm demonstrates that this Iraq War has been planned for many years. Yes, 9/11 was a convenient excuse.
By the way, where is Bin Laden?
Harry, please tell us you are not letting this administration off the hook for pulling America into this war!
— DTW 06 Dec 19, 12:37 AM # - Harry Reid is Bin Laden in disguise.
— the gop won get over it Dec 19, 12:38 AM # - 2006 is about to begin. Get ready to inherit the backlash smart ass!
— DTW 06 Dec 19, 12:41 AM # - I see the white flag waving crowd paid no attention to the President’s admonition. I wonder if Democrats are just a bunch of sore losers or if they really want to see America destroyed?
— joro Dec 19, 12:52 AM # - NPR just reported that at the close of Cheney’s speech to the troops in Iraq today, there was no applause or cheering. Supposedly there was one lone whistle. The ONLY WAY that all these overamped kids could have expressed such a unified response is by direct command from a superior. If the command structure in Iraq is getting pissed off enough to actually diss the Vice President, than this is indeed going to get veeeeery interesting.
— Pissed Off American Dec 19, 12:56 AM # - #9.
Obviously you were never in the military. Were you another Clintonesgue draft dodger? Those of us who served our country know the protocol when a superior officer spoke to us. The lack of patriotism and lack of knowledge about America by liberals never ceases to amaze me.
— joro Dec 19, 02:33 AM # - Joro,
These candy ass liberals don’t understand anything. They still think they hold power.
I can’t wait for 2006 the Dem’s will pay the price at the polls.
They are like kids on the school yard waiting to have their lunch money taken from them.
— the gop won get over it Dec 19, 02:41 AM # - Like #2 said, I was thinking that Brother Reid had put his partisan ways behind him, but I was mistaken. When the US fought and won World War II, was there any whining about fixing milestones and benchmarks for victory. No, the only benchmark was total and complete victory and we cannot opbtain that by setting and arbitrary date to “cut and run” the way certain Vietnam veterans would have us to believe. As has been pointed out before, the Democratic party has morphed into a part of defeatists who are apparently only to happy to surrender to the terrorists. Why would anyone want to vote to surrender? Like President Bush pointed out:
“We do not create terrorists by fighting them. We invite terrorism by ignoring them and we will defeat the terrorists by capturing and killing them abroad…”
So, which is the best approach to fighting terrorism? If you believe the Defeato-crats, it’s to ignore the problem, like President Klinton did and to hope that the big attack happens on someone else’s watch. Thank heavens for President Bush who sees the danger now and has the balls to do something about it now, not later. As I often said during the 2004 elections, I didn’t want a president who would make the world safer for Americans, I wanted a president who would make the world more dangerous for terrorists. If you cannot see the difference in the two statements, let’s put it this way. The only good terrorists are a dead terrorists, whether in Iraq, Afghanistan or the United States.
— El-ahrairah Dec 19, 05:03 AM # - El-ahrairah ,
Amen my brother.
If Jimmy Carter had gone in and wiped out Iran back in 1979 we would not be talking about their nuclear capabilities today.
We would have set the tone for dealing with countries that encourage terrorism now.
— the gop won get over it Dec 19, 05:17 AM # - Saturday, June 04, 2005
Copyright © Las Vegas Review-Journal
Reid won’t be returning lobbyist contributions
Spokeswoman says senator sees no reason to return funds
By TONY BATT
STEPHENS WASHINGTON BUREAU
WASHINGTON—Senate Democratic Leader Harry Reid will not return campaign contributions he received during the past five years from lobbyists and clients associated with Jack Abramoff, a Reid spokeswoman said Friday.
Federal officials are investigating whether Abramoff, a lobbyist, bilked millions of dollars from Indian gaming tribes.
Reid, D-Nev., and other Democrats have been sharply critical of House Majority Leader Tom DeLay, R-Texas, who has close ties to Abramoff.
About two-thirds of Abramoff-related campaign funds were given to Republicans. But The Washington Post reported that Abramoff also cultivated Democrats, including Reid.
Reid received $6,500 from Abramoff’s associates at the Greenberg Traurig law and lobbying firm from 1999 through 2004, The Washington Post reported Friday.
During the same period, Reid received $40,500 from Indian tribes that were Abramoff clients, the paper reported based on research of federal records.
Reid does not know Abramoff, Reid spokeswoman Tessa Hafen said.
But Abramoff hired Eddie Ayoob, who was Reid’s legislative counsel until 2002 and was assistant finance director on Reid’s 1998 Senate campaign.
Ayoob held a fund-raising reception for Reid at the offices of Greenberg Traurig, according to The Washington Post.
Calls to Ayoob on Friday were not returned. Ayoob left Greenberg Traurig earlier this year to join Barnes & Thornburg, another Washington law firm.
Hafen said Ayoob has not done any fund-raising for Reid this year. But, she added, “there is no reason to expect that he will not continue to raise money.”
Reid declined an interview request Friday. Hafen said he sees no reason to return the money.
“Indian tribes have the same opportunity as anyone else to participate in the political process,” Hafen said. “There is no reason to even make that suggestion.”
Federal investigators are examining millions of dollars that Abramoff collected from Indian tribes for lobbying and public relations work.
Reid received his contributions while serving on the Senate Indian Affairs Committee. He gave up that assignment after he was elected minority leader late last year.
Ernie Stevens, Jr., chairman of the National Indian Gaming Association, said he does not think money from gaming tribes has made a big difference with Reid.
“We don’t always agree with Senator Reid, but I think he has been consistent on Indian gaming issues, and I don’t think the contributions have changed his posture on any of those issues,” Stevens said. “This is all part of the political process and we have a right to participate.”
— US Congress 'most corrupt in history' Dec 19, 06:42 AM # - U.S. Senate Democratic leader Harry Reid called the Republican-led Congress “the most corrupt in history” on Sunday, and distanced himself from lobbyist Jack Abramoff, at the center of an escalating probe.
“Don’t lump me in with Jack Abramoff. This is a Republican scandal,” Reid told Fox News Sunday, saying he never received any money from Abramoff.
Reid, like many members of Congress, Democrats and Republicans, has received campaign contributions from Abramoff clients. Some lawmakers have returned those donations, but Reid gave no indication he would do so.
Sorry Harry, my mistake I thought this was about Harry Reid Senator from Nevada
— US Congress 'most corrupt in history' Dec 19, 06:48 AM # - For those wondering what happened to Bin Laden here is Harry Reids take on it:
Reid thinks Bin Laden was killed in Pakistan earthquake
Speaking on News 4’s Nevada News Makers,Reid says he was informed that Bin Laden may have died in the October temblor.
“I heard today that he may have died in the earthquake that they had in Pakistan, seriously.” Reid says that if that is the case, “that’s good for the world.”
When asked about Bin Laden during an exclusive News 4 interview, Reid said, “I’m not sure he is alive anymore. I think perhaps the earthquake took him down. I certainly hope so.”
— the gop won get over it Dec 19, 07:07 AM # - That’s because Bush has no intentions of leaving Iraq. He went there to stay there. It’s a triple barrel policy: Give Israel whatever they want using the same hatred propaganda that was used against them by the NAZIs, and secondly his BigOil relatives have to have something to do. These same kooks also participate in the war machine, and we know there is profit in that.
Thirdly, Wolfowitz as the head of the World Bank will, um, “help” poor countries, by investigating what they have as natural resources as collateral.
Putin kicked him out. LOL.
As long as we know Bush never intends to leave Iraq, we can’t let up until we are out of Iraq.
“Globalization” means, what we are doing to Iraq, and the phoney argument is that these are “bad people;” “inferior.” It’s sick. Bush is a madman.
Kathleen
— Kathleen M. Dickson Dec 19, 07:26 AM # - Yes Dingy, it will be a year of significant transition. The American public are going to continue to come to the stark realization that the donkey party has nothing of substance to offer them. Especially so when it come to national security. The demos have been on the wrong side of history for 35 years now. And you continue on the same road.
So Dingy, thanks to your help, the transition is going to be the GOP adding seats in both chambers of Congress.
Keep flapping your lips Dingy, you’re helping the Republicans every day.
— John in CA Dec 19, 07:53 AM # - #12 – Using WWII as a comparison to Iraq is laughable, if it weren’t so tragic for the 2,100+ American dead you are so willing to sacrifice. Do you have any family over there?
While we are speaking of WWII, whose grandfather helped fund the Nazis up until 1943?
#8 – As far a “white flag waving” I doubt anyone here argued that we should go into Afghanistan. How are things going over there?
It has been stated by US military sources that only 5% of Iraqi insurgents are foreign fighters. The neocon answer to making this a war on terror is to label every fighter a terrorist.
So, as usual the intellectually dishonest folks like the lunchyard bullies (who seem to have taken over this blog) resort to name calling and the black and white world of their draft dodging leaders. In the mean time real terrorists are given safe haven and funding in many parts of Saudi Arabia and Pakistan, and the Taliban is re-emerging in Afghanistan.
Wake up punks, and quit spitting on the constitution. That’s right, you don’t care about the constitution, its power and Bush you worship. It must be reassuing to live in your B&W fantasy land. Just don’t try to tell the rest of us it makes us safer!
Have a nice day:)
— DTW 06 Dec 19, 08:04 AM # - #10, joro, were you in the millitary? When?
#11, yes we’ll see at the polls just like you lost gubernatorial seats, you’ll loose even more in the congress.
#12, camparing this to ww2 is not appropiate.
This was a war of choice.
“If the citizens neglect their Duty and place unprincipled men in office, the government will soon be corrupted; laws will be made, not for the public good so much as for selfish or local purposes; corrupt or incompetent men will be appointed to execute the Laws; the public revenues will be squandered on unworthy men; and the rights of the citizen will be violated or disregarded.”
Noah Webster – (1758-1843) American patriot and scholar, author of the 1806 edition of the dictionary that bears his name, the first dictionary of American English usage.
— Jesus was a LIBERAL! Dec 19, 09:06 AM # - First they ignore you,
then they laugh at you.
Then they fight you,
and then you win! – Ghandi
— Daddy Dec 19, 09:13 AM # - John McCain: “Presidents are not ordinary citizens. They are extraordinary, in that they are vested with so much more authority and power than the rest of us. We have a right; indeed, we have an obligation, to hold them strictly accountable to the rule of law.”
excerpt from President Eisenhower’s farewell address to the nation, January 1961
“In the counsels of Government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the Military Industrial Complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists, and will persist. We must never let the weight of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. We should take nothing for granted. Only an alert and knowledgeable citizenry can compel the proper meshing of the huge industrial and military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals so that security and liberty may prosper together.”
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that we are to stand by the president, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public. Nothing but the truth should be spoken about him or anyone else. But it is even more important to tell the truth, pleasant or unpleasant, about him than about anyone else.” ~ Teddy Roosevelt, Kansas City Star,7 May 1918
— Jesus was a LIBERAL! Dec 19, 09:16 AM # - “still not heard what benchmarks we must meet”, what the hell is GiveEmHell Harry talking about. Either he has not read the Plan for Victory or he is dumber than a box of rocks. There are specific benchmarks of success based on results. Of course, dems want benchmarks based on some arbitrary time table, which is just plain stupid. Benchmarks based on results is a tool to evaluate progress, so that you can do what works and correct what doesn’t. Benchmarks based on time is a cry baby’s way of saying I can’t take anymore, when can we get out. Thank GOD Kerry lost. BTW, whoever talked to the media about NSA’s effort to moniter and set up surveillance against terrorist efforts is a traitor and ought to be hung. My guess is that Dingy was the ring leader of his little circus.
— Kerry Lost Dec 19, 09:21 AM # - Little man panics when asked about Abramoff
Senate Democratic leader Harry Reid called the Republican-led Congress ‘’the most corrupt in history’’ on Sunday, and distanced himself from lobbyist Jack Abramoff, at the center of an escalating probe. The Justice Department is investigating whether Jack Abramoff directed illegal payoffs to lawmakers, including Rep. Tom DeLay of Texas /break/ Reid, like many members of Congress, Democrats and Republicans, has received campaign contributions from Abramoff clients.
Reid sounds little nervous about this. That’s probably because you could count the number of honest Democrats that hve been in Congress the last 20 years on one hand and still have enough fingers left to flash a victory sign.
Deepthinker’s speech to congress:
“This is, without any doubt, the most irresponsible, mean-spirited, and partisan opposition we have seen in the history of the Republic. Week after week, we hear lying smear after lying smear from a Democratic party with no constructive proposals nor the slightest respect for truth….”
Not to worry about the $50K from Abramoff. Reid will just return the money and deny any wrongdoing. The press will hail Reid as a man of honesty and the $50K as a non-story.
Reid doesn’t know what day it is and he’s telling me about history? Alfred E Reid What, me think ?
The corruption factor went up exponentially when Hitlery became a member.
Where is the Barrett report???All anyone needs to do is follow the money. DeLay’s receipt of donation money from Abramoff has been labeled the crime of the season. However, it’s pretty obvious that Harry Reid and other Democratic members of Congress have also received donations from Jack Abramoff. Of course, THEIR cash receipts are supposed to be ‘hidden.’ It is no doubt given to a firm, which transfers it to a person, who gives it to an organization, which gives it to a company …..... which donates it to Reid. Then, Harry can state, as he did here …... ‘Abramoff gave me no money.’
Harry, my boy, we are not as stupid as you would like to think. I fully suspect this accusation against Tom DeLay is going to jump back and bite you and other liberals in your leftist behinds.
— Porcius Dec 19, 09:22 AM # - #23,
I suspect you are correct on all counts!
Remember when Harry attempted to discredit a Judicial nominee by inferring there was evidence against him in a FBI file?
— Kee Dec 19, 09:25 AM # - A year of significant transition yes Harry from
Abramoff pocket into yours, fess up little fellah !!
Nevada needs to look for a new Senator
we need to lynch a few Commie libbers this year .
Harry can you say hypocrite ,practice it.
— Porcius Dec 19, 09:32 AM # - Nevada needs to look for a new Senator
we need to lynch a few Commie libbers this year .
-Porcius
It figures that you guys are for lynching! I guess you’d support Hitler if he was selected president too!
— Jesus was a LIBERAL! Dec 19, 09:38 AM # - Oh dear, Harry. I believe you’ve hit a nerve. There are even more trolls than usual. I do think it’s time to dust off the rules for impeachment. It is rather unusual for the subject of impeachment to admit to the crime on national television. Perhaps he means to rely on shear stupidity as a defense.
utahgirl
— utahgirl Dec 19, 09:40 AM # - Good point #25. Harry is not concerned about the safety of America, except for his idealistic version of it. Can you feel 2006 slipping away from them?
— Kerry Lost Dec 19, 09:40 AM # - #27…..Harry was all for “lynching” when he misled people about the Judicial nominee, also when he tried to find Libby guilty without a trial! Those two items are the tip of the iceberg with dirty Nevadan politics.
— Kee Dec 19, 09:42 AM # - http://www.cannonfire.blogspot.com/
— bill_o_carolina Dec 19, 09:43 AM # - #28 Perhaps he means to rely on shear stupidity as a defense.
It has worked for Dems for years. Hmmm…it just might work. Except he is too smart for that.
— Kerry Lost Dec 19, 09:43 AM # - WHERE”S PHASE 2? DEMAND IT NOW AND ALERT THE MSM!
— bill_o_carolina Dec 19, 09:46 AM # - Upon further consideration, I like Murtha’s plan to retreat. Let’s retreat to Iran and Syria.
— Kerry Lost Dec 19, 09:51 AM # - #34, I think that’s Cheney’s plan!
— bill_o_carolina Dec 19, 09:56 AM # - You go where the threat is rather than let it come here like on 9-11. Thank GOD for your first amendment rights, Bill. When people like you and Harry create a blog, you only speak the truth about who YOU are when you spew your vebal vomit and it gets on my white collar shirt.
— Kerry Lost Dec 19, 10:04 AM # - #36 you mean like you’re doing now? You are an elitist?
— bill_o_carolina Dec 19, 10:21 AM # - If your definition of elitist is one who believes they deserve a higher standard and quality of “rights” than others, you are sadly mistaken. If you feel I am an elitist because I believe the quality of my words are correct/factual and your words are garbage, then I would have to agree. I am sorry if that is what you consider to be an elitist. I value and fight for your right to say what ever you wish, no matter how wrong.
— Kerry Lost Dec 19, 10:33 AM # - BTW, I paint houses for a living. I said “white collar” because that is what you believe anyway. No matter what the administration says, you go on believing what you want to. Harry Reid’s latest blog entry is the perfect example. He has selective hearing.
— Kerry Lost Dec 19, 10:37 AM # - You lie! You said white collar because you are! Paint houses my ass! What a maroon!
— bill_o_carolina Dec 19, 10:44 AM # - See what I mean!! A house painter could never vote for Bush, right? Why, I must own oil company!! Pathetic.
— Kerry Lost Dec 19, 10:51 AM # - I know you came her to advertise your blog, but you should quit while you are behind. You keep this up and any traffic you have already established will diminish to zero.
— Kerry Lost Dec 19, 11:04 AM # - A house painter indeed could vote for Bush. But first you say you’re white collar, then you say you paint houses for a living. Well which is it flip-flopper? Can you not see that you lost your credibility? Of course not repugnantcons do not value integrity, only money.
Go ahead and sign in under one of your other screennames and try again.
— bill_o_carolina Dec 19, 11:06 AM # - And we know you came here to earn your propaganda money!
— bill_o_carolina Dec 19, 11:10 AM # - You can go ahead and attack liberals if it makes you feel better. But you might want to ponder the fact that the Founding Fathers of this country were liberals. The liberal administrations of Wilson and Roosevelt led the United States to victory in two world wars. Liberals are patriots, and they always have been.
1) We want an administration that makes decisions based upon FACTS. We don’t have that, we have an administration that is makes decisions based upon rigid ideological beliefs.
2) We want an American government that takes responsibility for its mistakes. We don’t have that. We have an administration that conceals its mistakes and demonizes anyone who dares criticize it.
3) We want an American government that respects the patriotism of people who disagree with current government policies. We don’t have that. We have an administration that blames EVERY problem on “the left” or the “liberal media” or “the evildoers.”
4) We want an American government that considers the truth a valuable tool for governing. We dont have that. We have an administration that considers the truth an obstacle to overcome as it pursues its covert agendas.
5) We want an American government that honors the service and sacrifices of our soldiers by leading a logical, coherent war on global terrorism. We don’t have that. We have an administration that has been obsessed about Iraq since Day 1 and is fighting the wrong war at the wrong time in the wrong place.
6) We want an American government that understands that democracies cannot survive without political compromise. We don’t have that. This administration projects self-righteous omniscience and considers political compromise a sign of weakness.
I respect what you are trying to accomplish in Iraq, however a Muslim “nation” of 22,000,000 people cannot be stabilized by 130,000 foreign soldiers. Tragically, while you are saving a few trees, the whole forest is burning down around you. Our misadventure in Iraq is making the global situation worse, not better.
— bill_o_carolina Dec 19, 11:15 AM # - Tee hee. You are just palin weird and grasping for straws. You say I lost credibility, but you have gained none. I was making a point about the dem’s assumptions of conservatives and you continue to fail at understanding the point. I would love to keep this up all day, but I “actually” have houses to go paint. I mean, drill for oil, bath in money, take over nations, dodge taxes, lynch black people, stamp on gay people, convert satatinists and whatever else stereo type you refuse to let go of. Trust me. I’ll check back later after my day is done. You continue to dig your hole and I’ll be back to laugh. Liberal’s stupidity would be comical if it were not so dangerous.
— Kerry Lost Dec 19, 11:20 AM # - Let’s see… would it be stripes or dayglo orange for a convicted president?
utahgirl
— utahgirl Dec 19, 11:43 AM # - These neocon creeps all have skeletons in their closets, they have been so hubrissed-up with their delusion of power, like Delay, feeling immune to justice because they assume they control the Justice Department and the courts and all the rights to Congressional inquiry.
But Justice has a different master than they imagine, and it moves against the ungodly at no man’s command. When Justice demands a reckoning, those skeletons will be rattled, and no political party power can resist it.
Especially the Republicans, now they’ve got the RNC monkeys hounding this blog, if they really want to see the face of terrorism, in the eyes of most of the world, they should go look in the mirror.
Warmongers claiming Jesus, economic monopolists claiming free enterprise, fascists claiming democrocy.
Where are the real Republicans any more? Fiscal conservatives for small government? Yeah, right…
And by the way, the GOP didn’t win, they cheated.
All you BushCult brainwashed orks and trolls are afraid to even look at the mounting proof of it, you just call us sore losers instead of arguing the obvious facts.
You were all willing to surrender the constitution at the drop of the word “mushroom cloud.” You are all so scard of Bin Laden, you made him a legend in the Muslim world.
Cowards and hypocrites, you just cut and run from the very freedoms our ancestors fought and died for.
You gave up precious freedoms HERE AT HOME because you were afraid of Bin Laden.
Cowards. What are you willing to give up next for this warmongering crowd, you sons and daughters?
You spent so much time attacking Clinton in your partisan impeachment, our entire nation was put at risk from the distraction. And now you want to blame everyone but the responsible parties.
The Truth stands alone, and none of you can shake it. You can only deny it.
JEP
— John Patterson Dec 19, 12:05 PM # - One of the biggest complaints I have ever had about President Bush is his secrecy, fortunately for all of us he seems to have given up some ground on this issue.
Although congress still needs to rain in on his powers. I have nothing wrong with a powerful president, but when that president questions my American rights I begin to wonder.
JJ Glendenning
— JJ Glendenning Dec 19, 12:09 PM # - Oh my goodness! That was a very amusing news conference. I guess Saddamosama bin Forgotten.
utahgirl
— utahgirl Dec 19, 12:38 PM # - To our friends from the RNC;
The GOP can’t win an honest election anymore, they must cheat on a massive scale just to stay in office.
Most of you know that for a fact. A few of you feel quite ashamed of that fact, but you are trapped in a circle of obligation that you never imagined was part of the deal. You signed on because you had ideals and integrity and you wanted to use them to help the party.
Now, instead of playing good politics and winning with superior qualities, you conjur up daily lies, and send them out through trolls and orks across the airwaves and blogosphere.
What moral code does that come from? At least admit to honor among thieves, but don’t give me that “values” crap, you Republicans made their peace with hypocrisy long ago. I believe many of you would galdly take part in a rigged election just because you think you are protecting Democracy from the evil influence of the Democrats.
How ignorant, and self-flagellating, can you get? You mock Democracy itself by acquiescing to this deception.
There is too much proof of election tampering for it to go unresolved, and it is my guess there’s more than one hard drive that can divulge the truth… And more than one conspirator who regrets their part in the deception and the conspiracy to perpetrate and perpetuate it..
Why can’t election officials look into these Diebolc voting machines, if they aren’t rigged?
Simple logic dictates they’re hiding something. Otherwise, they would be glad to be scrutinized, just to shut us all up. If it was the other way around, with Democrats winning in questionable results, you would all be screaming “treason.”
HYPOCRITES!!
JEP
— John Patterson Dec 19, 12:42 PM # - The trolls (troll) here are (is) attempting to “jam” the threads with this bullshit they are casting. I strongly suggest you attempt to IGNORE the more obvious inanities they are offering as distractions. As much as I am disgusted by Reid’s mewling comment and his unwillingness to go beyond the opportunistic grandstanding we saw in his Senate Charade, the RW propaganda machine must be intimidated by him, or they would not be trolling this site with such fervor. If you continue to engage these assholes they will literally destroy this website. Again, I suggest you ignore them.
Anyone notice how rare the truly “honest and sincere” citizen’s post in support of Bush is becoming??? We see less and less thoughtful postings in support of Bush or his policy, and see more and more of these types of empty blatherings by the obvious trolls, such as this thread is mostly comprised of.
— Pissed Off American Dec 19, 12:42 PM # - “Simple logic dictates they’re hiding something. Otherwise, they would be glad to be scrutinized, just to shut us all up. If it was the other way around, with Democrats winning in questionable results, you would all be screaming “treason.””
John, have you ever seen HARRY utter the word “Diebold”? Hillary? Kerry??? As far as I know, Conyers is the only one to have made an issue of this. I’m telling you man, you better drop this partisan horseshit and start realizing that BOTH sides of the fence are covered with slime.
— Pissed Off American Dec 19, 12:48 PM # - This thread needs to be more like conyers blog, where some civility is required or you’re banned.
— Jesus was a LIBERAL! Dec 19, 12:56 PM # - Again, to our friends at the RNC, specifically;
Joro’s suggestion that “we” want to see America somehow destroyed by “The Terrorists” disregards one of history’s most fertile lessons.
No great world-power has ever been overthrown from without, they all collapsed from within, doomed by their own hubris. To suggest that a handful of Arabs could do such damage is sensationalism at best and outright thought reform at worst.
Start adding up the indictments, the charges and allegations and investigations, and there is clearly an implosion going on in America’s ruling party, and it is not foreign terrorists who are creating it, unless Osama has been hiding on K Street.
They have done it all by themselves, with with a lot of help from their lobbyist friends, all of them demanding Quid Pro Quotas.
If their own members weren’t such blind loyalists and stood up to their felonious leaders, the Republican Party might not have started its collapse. But even the rank and file are williing to cheat, because the option (honest democracy) doesn’t meet their needs.
Unfortunately, their very political strength depended on heavy-handed tactics and bullying their agendas, insider deals and illegal junkets to St. Andrews. Now those who spawned these profane constructs, like Tom Delay and Karl Rove, are in the hot spotlight of public scrutiny. The very journalists they used as pawns are now waking up and turning back on them.
So without their “ends justifies the means” bullies at the helm, the Republican ship of fools careens back and forth across the waves, troughing and tossing like a cork on the ocean of public opinion.
If they give the wheel back to someone like Delay, they will surely be swamped and tipped.
It may already be too late.
JEP
— John Patterson Dec 19, 01:03 PM # - ECHELON please check the date of this 60 minutes broadcast Bill Clinton was the President way didn’t he put an end to it , if it was so wrong?
60 MINUTES
Television Broadcast February 27, 2000
ECHELON; WORLDWIDE CONVERSATIONS BEING RECEIVED BY THE ECHELON SYSTEM MAY FALL INTO THE WRONG HANDS AND INNOCENT PEOPLE MAY BE TAGGED AS SPIES
STEVE KROFT, co-host:
If you made a phone call today or sent an e-mail to a friend, there’s a good chance what you said or wrote was captured and screened by the country’s largest intelligence agency. The top-secret Global Surveillance Network is called Echelon, and it’s run by the National Security Agency and four English-speaking allies: Canada, Great Britain, Australia and New Zealand.
The mission is to eavesdrop on enemies of the state: foreign countries, terrorist groups and drug cartels. But in the process, Echelon’s computers capture virtually every electronic conversation around the world.
How does it work, and what happens to all the information that’s gathered? A lot of people have begun to ask that question, and some suspect that the information is being used for more than just catching bad guys.
(Footage of satellite; person talking on cell phone; fax machine; ATM being used; telephone pole and wires; radio towers)
KROFT: (Voiceover) We can’t see them, but the air around us is filled with invisible electronic signals, everything from cell phone conversations to fax transmissions to ATM transfers. What most people don’t realize is that virtually every signal radiated across the electromagnetic spectrum is being collected and analyzed.
How much of the world is covered by them?
Mr. MIKE FROST (Former Spy): The entire world, the whole planet—covers everything. Echelon covers everything that’s radiated worldwide at any given instant.
KROFT: Every square inch is covered.
Mr. FROST: Every square inch is covered.
(Footage of Frost; listening post)
KROFT: (Voiceover) Mike Frost spent 20 years as a spy for the CSE, the Canadian equivalent of the National Security Agency, and he is the only high-ranking former intelligence agent to speak publicly about the Echelon program. Frost even showed us one of the installations where he says operators can listen in to just about anything.
Mr. FROST: Everything from—from data transfers to cell phones to portable phones to baby monitors to ATMs…
KROFT: Baby monitors?
Mr. FROST: Oh, yeah. Baby monitors give you a lot of intelligence.
(Footage of listening posts)
KROFT: (Voiceover) This listening post outside Ottawa is just part of a network of spy stations, which are hidden in the hills of West Virginia, in remote parts of Washington state, even in plain view among the sheep pastures of Europe.
This is Menwith Hill Station in the Yorkshire countryside of Northern England. Even though we’re on British soil, Menwith Hill is an American base operated by the National Security Agency. It’s believed to be the largest spy station in the world.
(Footage of Menwith Hill Station; aerial footage of NSA headquarters; supercomputers)
KROFT: (Voiceover) Inside each globe are huge dishes which intercept and download satellite communications from around the world. The information is then sent on to NSA headquarters at Fort Meade, Maryland, where acres of supercomputers scan millions of transmissions word by word, looking for key phrases and, some say, specific voices that may be of major significance.
Mr. FROST: Everything is looked at. The entire take is looked at. And the computer sorts out what it is told to sort out, be it, say, by key words such as ‘bomb’ or ‘terrorist’ or ‘blow up,’ to telephone numbers or-or a person’s name. And people are getting caught, and-and that’s great.
(Footage of National Security Agency; Carlos the Jackal; two Libyans in court)
KROFT: (Voiceover) The National Security Agency won’t talk about those successes or even confirm that a program called Echelon exists. But it’s believed the international terrorist Carlos the Jackal was captured with the assistance of Echelon, and that it helped identify two Libyans the US believes blew up Pan-Am Flight 103.
Is it possible for people like you and I, innocent civilians, to be targeted by Echelon?
Mr. FROST: Not only possible, not only probable, but factual. While I was at CSE, a classic example: A lady had been to a school play the night before, and her son was in the school play and she thought he did a-a lousy job. Next morning, she was talking on the telephone to her friend, and she said to her friend something like this, ‘Oh, Danny really bombed last night,’ just like that. The computer spit that conversation out. The analyst that was looking at it was not too sure about what the conversation w-was referring to, so erring on the side of caution, he listed that lady and her phone number in the database as a possible terrorist.
KROFT: This is not urban legend you’re talking about. This actually happened?
Mr. FROST: Factual. Absolutely fact. No legend here.
(Vintage footage of Fonda; Spock; King; congressional hearing; the Capitol building)
KROFT: (Voiceover) Back in the 1970s, the NSA was caught red-handed spying on anti-war protesters like Jane Fonda and Dr. Benjamin Spock, and it turns out they had been recording the conversations of civil rights leaders like Martin Luther King in the 1960s. When Congress found out, it drafted strict, new laws prohibiting the NSA from spying on Americans, but today, there’s enough renewed concern about potential abuses that Congress is revisiting the issue.
Representative BOB BARR (Republican, Georgia): (From C-SPAN) One such project known as Project Echelon engages in the interception of literally millions of communications involving United States citizens.
(Footage of Barr; NSA sign; Goss and Kroft)
KROFT: (Voiceover) But even members of Congress have trouble getting information about Echelon. Last year, the NSA refused to provide internal memoranda on the program to Porter Goss, the chairman of the House Intelligence Committee.
What exactly was it that you requested?
Representative PORTER GOSS (Chairman, House Intelligence Committee): Well, I can’t get too specific about it, but there was some information about procedures in how the NSA people would employ some safeguards, and I wanted to see all the correspondence on that to make sure that those safeguards were being completely honored. At that point, one of the counsels of the NSA said, ‘Well, we don’t think we need to share this information with the Oversight Committee.’ And we said, ‘Well, we’re sorry about that. We do have the oversight, and you will share the information with us,’ and they did.
(Footage of Goss and Kroft)
KROFT: (Voiceover) But only after Goss threatened to cut the NSA’s budget. He still believes, though, that the NSA does not eavesdrop on innocent American citizens.
If the NSA has capabilities to screen enormous numbers of telephone calls, faxes, e-mails, whatnot, how do you filter out the American conversations, and how do you—how can you be sure that no one is listening to those conversations?
Rep. GOSS: We do have methods for that, and I am relatively sure that those procedures are working very well.
(Footage of Madsen; epic.org Web site; Amnesty International gathering; Greenpeace members in a boat; Princess Diana)
KROFT: (Voiceover) Others aren’t so sure. Wayne Madsen works with a group called the Electronic Privacy Information Center, which is suing the NSA to get a copy of the documents that were finally turned over to Congressman Goss. Madsen, a former naval officer who used to work for the NSA, is concerned about reports that Echelon has listened in on groups like Amnesty International and Greenpeace. Last year, the NSA was forced to acknowledge that it had more than 1,000 pages of information on the late Princess Diana.
Mr. WAYNE MADSEN (Electronic Privacy Information Center): Princess Diana, in her campaign against land mines, of course, was completely at odds with US policy, so her activities were of tremendous interest to-to the US policy-makers, of course, and-and, therefore, to the National Security Agency eavesdroppers.
KROFT: Do you think the—the NSA only monitored her conversations that involved land mines?
Mr. MADSEN: Well, when NSA extends the big drift net out there, it’s possible that they’re picking up more than just her conversations concerning land mines. What they do with that intelligence, who knows?
(Footage of newspaper headlines; Menwith Hill Station)
KROFT: (Voiceover) In the early 1990s, some of Diana’s personal conversations, as well as those of some others associated with the royal family, mysteriously appeared in the British tabloids. Could some of those conversations have been picked up by that US spy station in England?
Mr. MADSEN: (Voiceover) There’s been some speculation that Menwith Hill may have been involved in the intercepts of those communications as—as well.
And how-how could that be legal? Well, British intelligence could say, ‘Well, we didn’t eavesdrop on members of the British royal family. These happened to be conducted by, you know, one of our strategic partners.’ And, therefore, they would skirt the-skirt the British laws against intercepts of communications.
(Footage of National Security Agency sign)
KROFT: (Voiceover) The US admits it often shares intelligence with its allies, but never to get around the law.
Mr. FROST: Never, Steve, will governments admit that they can circumvent legislation by asking another country to do for them what they can’t do for themselves. They will never admit that. But that sort of thing is so easy to do. It is so commonplace.
KROFT: Do you have any first-hand experience?
Mr. FROST: I do have first-hand experience where CSE did some dirty work for Margaret Thatcher when she was prime minister. She…
KROFT: What kind of dirty work?
Mr. FROST: Well, at the time, she had two ministers that she said, quote, “They weren’t on side,” unquote, and she wanted to find out, not what these ministers were saying, but what they were thinking. So my boss, as a matter of fact, went to McDonald House in London and did intercept traffic from these two ministers. The British Parliament now have total deniability. They didn’t do anything. They know nothing about it. Of course they didn’t do anything; we did it for them.
(Footage of Newsham and Kroft)
KROFT: (Voiceover) One of the few people to acknowledge that they have listened to conversations over the Echelon system is Margaret Newsham, who worked at Menwith Hill in England back in 1979. She had a top secret security clearance.
So who-you-you knew that conversations were being pulled off satellites.
Ms. MARGARET NEWSHAM: Yes. But to my knowledge, all it was going to be would be like Russian, Chinese or, y—you know, foreign.
(Footage of Newsham)
KROFT: (Voiceover) But soon, she says, she discovered it wasn’t only the Russians and the Chinese who were the targets.
Ms. NEWSHAM: I walked into the office building and a friend said, ‘Come over here and listen to-to this thing.’ Andand he had headphones on, so I took the headphones and I listened to it, and-and I looked at him and I’m going, ‘That’s an American.’ And he said, ‘Well, yeah.’
KROFT: And it was definitely an American voice?
Ms. NEWSHAM: It was definitely an American voice, and it was a voice that was distinct. And I said, ‘Well, who is that?’ And he said it was Senator Strom Thurmond. And I go, ‘What?’
KROFT: Do you think this kind of stuff goes on?
Mr. FROST: Oh, of course it goes on. Been going on for years. Of course it goes on.
KROFT: You mean the National Security Agency spying on politicians in…
Mr. FROST: Well, I—I…
KROFT: ...in the United States?
Mr. FROST: Sounds ludicrous, doesn’t it? Sounds like the world of fiction. It’s not; not the world of fiction. That’s the way it works. I’ve been there. I was trained by you guys.
Rep. GOSS: Certainly possible that something like that could happen. The question is: What happened next?
KROFT: What do you mean?
Rep. GOSS: It is certainly possible that somebody overheard me in a conversation. I have just been in Europe. I have been talking to people on a telephone and elsewhere. So it’s very possible somebody could have heard me. But the question is: What do they do about it? I mean, I cannot stop the dust in the ether; it’s there. But what I can make sure is that it’s not abused—the capability’s not abused, and that’s what we do.
KROFT: Much of what’s known about the Echelon program comes not from enemies of the United States, but from its friends. Last year, the European Parliament, which meets here in Strasbourg, France, issued a report listing many of the Echelon’s spy stations around the world and detailing their surveillance capabilities. The report says Echelon is not just being used to track spies and terrorists. It claims the United States is using it for corporate and industrial espionage as well, gathering sensitive information on European corporations, then turning it over to American competitors so they can gain an economic advantage.
(Footage of report; plane; report; Raytheon sign; Ford and Kroft)
KROFT: (Voiceover) The European Parliament report alleges that the NSA ‘lifted all the faxes and phone calls’ between the European aircraft manufacturer Airbus and Saudi Arabian Airlines, and that the information helped two American companies, Boeing and McDonnell Douglas, win a $ 6 billion contract. The report also alleges that the French company Thomson-CSF lost a $ 1.3 billion satellite deal to Raytheon the same way. Glen Ford is the member of the European Parliament who commissioned the report.
Mr. GLEN FORD (European Parliament Member): It’s not the-if you want, the Echelon system that’s the problem. It’s how it’s being used. Now, you know, if we’re catching the bad guys, we’re completely in favor of that, whether it’s you catching the bad guys, us or anybody else. We don’t like the bad guys. What we’re concerned about is that some of the good guys in my constituency don’t have jobs because US corporations got an inside track on-on some global deal.
(Footage of encryption machine; Clinton and several men walking; Ford)
KROFT: (Voiceover) Increasingly, European governments and corporations are turning to something called encryption, a system of scrambling phone, fax or e-mail transmissions so that the Echelon system won’t be able to read them. The US is worried about the technology falling into the hands of terrorists or other enemies. The Clinton administration has been trying to persuade the Europeans to give law enforcement and intelligence agencies a key with which they can unlock the code in matters of national security. Glen Ford, the European parliamentarian, agrees it’s a good idea, in principle.
Mr. FORD: However, if we are not assured that that is n-not going to be abused, then I’m afraid we may well take the view, ‘Sorry, no.’ In the United Kingdom, it’s traditional for people to leave a key under the doormat if they want the neighbors to come in and-and do something in their house. Well, we’re neighbors, and we’re not going to leave the electronic key under the doormat if you’re going to come in and steal the family silver.
KROFT: Y—you said that you think that this is basically a good idea, that we have to do this at some…
Mr. FROST: Oh, in a perfect world, we would not need the NSA, we would not need CSE. But, you know, we have to. We have to in the areas of terrorism, drug lords. We-we’d be lost without them. My concern is no accountability and nothing-no safety net in place for the innocent people that fall through the cracks. That’s my concern.
KROFT: Accountability isn’t the only issue that’s of interest to Congress. There is growing concern within the intelligence community that encryption and the worldwide move to fiber-optic cables, which Echelon may not be able to penetrate, will erode the NSA’s ability to gather the intelligence vital to national security. The agency is looking for more money to develop new technologies.
————————————————————————————————————————
— the gop won get over it Dec 19, 01:27 PM # - POA;
“There is none righteous, no not one.”
It doesn’t just mean politicians, but I want you to know, I agree with you in your distrust of both party’s motives. That doesn’t mean I can’t join one of them and work for better days.
Like I said, degrees of hypocrisy are all we have to measure by, there is no one “good” or “bad,” just degrees between the extremes.
You are right about your issues, but you are wrong about your loyalties. Your anger and your indignation can only be assuaged by finding a place within, rather than without, to work from. I know this from my own evolution in democracy.
Just like the Republicans are imploding from within, you can use the Democratic Party to build from within.
POA, please note, very carefully, these next few words;
There are lots of good Democrats who feel just like you do, but very few Republicans.
If you try to sweep the floor clean with an Independent broom, you will just move the dust around and give the Republicans more access to power.
Didn’t you understand what I meant about taking this Washington dragon on at the head?
You slap-fight with the tail, (rank and file Democrats) while you should be bearing down courageously against the fire-breathing head, that neocon war-machine that threatens to consume the whole world in war-for-profit, a perpetual conflict in the name of money.
Don’t just blog around urging the tail to master the head.
Do something meaningful. Join a political party and work from within. Otherwise, your words, no matter how right you might be, get lost in the winds of futlity.
JEP
— John Patterson Dec 19, 01:28 PM # - Mr Reid (or anyone else here for that matter)
Please define “War”, “Victory” and “Goal”.
As an aside:
At least you look good in the papers, sir.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20051218/pl_nm/congress_ethics_dc
I would think a real man would do some investigating on where that money came from, and if it was obtained illegally or unethically, one would certainly hope that you would have the decency to admit that you have made a mistake.
We sure wouldn’t hold it against you.
— Sean Dec 19, 01:30 PM # - Post 56 is proof they are getting desperate. Its boring and meaningless, its an old ProTroll trick to paste in tedious and obscure, outdated references, to keep everyone else from reading through this blog. They figure if they can make it boring and tedious then all the activity will subside.
This isn’t Blogs for Bush.
You are talking to intelligent people who think for themselves. A link to the story would suffice, we aren’t kindergarteners.
If you want to pontificate with your own words, write all you want, bu if you refer us to another piece, just paraphraze it, give us the link, and let us do our own research.
We aren’t Republican numbskull brainwashed cultists, we think for ourselves and form our own opinions based on our own ideas, and do research to help us form those opinions, we don’t just take them spoonfed from the RNC.
I tend to agree with POA, on this troll in particualr, just ignore their posts, they are not even provocatuers, they are boring.
— John Patterson Dec 19, 01:39 PM # - “You slap-fight with the tail, (rank and file Democrats) while you should be bearing down courageously against the fire-breathing head, that neocon war-machine that threatens to consume the whole world in war-for-profit, a perpetual conflict in the name of money.”
If you haven’t noticed, these mewling cowards you cite, the “rank and file democrats”, are the only weapons we have to fight these bastards in the White House. If someone hands me a sword, I am going to do my best to make sure the damn thing is sharp before I go traipsing into the battlefield. Do you find the words at the beginning of this thread “sharp”?? Reid’s words are just mewling cowtowing political HORSESHIT. You KNOW that that IS the truth. Read it again. This is the GOD DAMNED minority LEADER for chrisakes, and he is casting this limpwristed political doublespeak about while it is disclosed this son of a bitch in the Oval Office is illegally spying on American Citizens???? HORSESHIT!!!!! You want to accept that these mewling cowtowing opportunistic political SCHMUCKS are the best we can do, then FINE. But I tell you what, if the kind of useless horseshit that Reid offers here in this post is the best he can do than I suggest you take a long look at the Monkey Boy and that satanistic sick son of a bitch Cheney and understand that they are your future.
— Pissed Off American Dec 19, 01:53 PM # - #59
Yes, they are desperate. But “they” are usually just one guy posting over and over again with different names. Some posts are legit. Some are not.
— Attorney Jim Dec 19, 01:55 PM # - Post #59
Thanks for the heads up. This is my first time doing this. Sorry
— the gop won get over it Dec 19, 02:00 PM # - Hi, everyone. I’m a troll from the Bradblog website. I’ve crossed over to disrupt this website the way I temporarily ruined the Conyersblog.
I spread lies and insults while posting under multiple names. I invite you to check out my greatest hits at
Bradblog.com . His website has a search engine, just type in attorney jim, atty jim, jimmo, taco tom,
and a bunch of other ridiculous names.
I love GW so much, I’m willing to follow him over a cliff. I need you all to join me.
— Attorney Jim Dec 19, 02:18 PM # - From POA’s last post;
“I suggest you take a long look at the Monkey Boy and that satanistic sick son of a bitch Cheney and understand that they are your future.”
That’s the dragonshead I’m talking about. At least you recognize that fact. But by lumping all parties into one party, you are cornering yourself into a hopeless agenda.
I refuse to be hopeless, but I don’t put much hope in us humans. I consider these indictments and criminal charges against the neocons as a divine intervention.
Justice, in a purely spiritual sense, is just as pissed off as you are. Someone threw a blanket over her head, and she wants payback.
No power on Earth can turn her hand away from her righteous vengeance. They can only forestall her retribution, and turn on one another in the chaos.
If not for Harry and some other Democrats, Patrick Fitzgerald would never have had the power to form his grand juries. What you perceive as the Democrat’s complicity in the BushCult deception is better defined as the wheels of minority rights turning ever-so-slowly against the wheel of majority abuse.
Harry Reid is not Harry Potter. He can’t wave a magic wand and make you happy, POA. He is the MINORITY leader, not the MAJORITY leader.
But like most of the Democrats, he’s doing whatever he can to make the changes you demand, whether it is fast enough for you or not.
You just can’t get it through your head that your urgency will not be the determining factor in this timetable. While you and those like you certainly influence the directional meanderings of our government, there is no way to speed up that flow, short of outright rebellion and revolution.
Their response will never match your demands.
JEP
— John Patterson Dec 19, 02:20 PM # - The poll results I heard this morning after the President’s speech last night show that the new PR war is NOT working. Onlyu 31% of those polled said they’re optimistic about what will happen in Iraq and 69% are pessimistic. This just proves that the same old BS from the Bush Administration is not working. People want the truth.
— RenoResident Dec 19, 02:38 PM # - Just re-read post # 9 (POA) and 10 (JORO)again,
POA you accomplish so much more with these kind of posts than all your tirades combined. This is what a blog is best used for.
if Joro or any of our trolls think Cheney’s speech went un-applauded because of some military protocol, they need to watch all the recent footage of Bush at military gatherings. HYPOCRITES!!
What was Cheney doing in Iraq in the first place? He hasn’t been there since 1991, it might seem to free-thinking Americans that he was using the troops for political grandstanding.
Could it possibly be that OUR VICE PRESIDENT USED OUR TROOPS TO STAGE A POLITICAL EVENT and the soldiers did not appreciate being used?
SO they refused to applaud their shadow commander in chief, because he spewed the same garbage to them that he feeds to his fat and happy billionaire base, and the troops knew what a lie it all was? They are in the thick of it, if anyone knows Cheney is a liar, it’s the troops he lies about.
Anyone who thinks our soldiers are all BushCult members hasn’t talked to many of them. Bush and Cheney throw the word Patriot around much too easily.
Those soldiers who dissed Cheney are the real patriots, they’ve been there and done that, and they don’t support Bush en masse, like Cheney apparently thought they would.
The All-Star wrestlers raised morale more than Cheney ever could.
Put old Dick in a roped-off ring in Baghdad, with a couple lady wrestlers, you might get some applause from those troops.
JEP
— John Patterson Dec 19, 02:44 PM # - “But like most of the Democrats, he’s doing whatever he can to make the changes you demand, whether it is fast enough for you or not. ”
Again, I implore you to read Reid’s words at the beginning of this thread. It is useless self serving horseshit. You know it, and I know it, and anyone with two or more brain cells knows it. To call those words “doing whatever he can” is ludicrous to the extreme. It is not ME that can’t get concepts and truths through my head, it is YOU. And the truth is that the kind of mewling horseshit that Reid offers at the beginning of this thread accomplishes NOTHING. ZIP. NADA. And you can be damned sure that these mewling pissants will spew this useless pablum as long as their constituency allows them to. It is time, NOW, to DEMAND that these opportunistic self serving sons of bitches start doing their jobs before this criminal cabal in the White House decides it is time to serve up another “trifecta” to get the American people back on the fear bus.
BTW, why are you pimping for Reid? Why not use this blog to implore him to answer the three simple questions I pose here in my opening comment on this thread? Does he REQUIRE an apologist? Join me in seeking a response to my simple questions. Whats the harm?
— Pissed Off American Dec 19, 02:53 PM # - POA;
I have always wanted the answers to those questions. But I don’t expect them to come in the form of paragraphs and sentences. The results will show up in ways you might not see, especially if you expect easy answers from people like Harry, who’s only hope for influence is to play a game of political chess you could never understand.
Here’s an example you should appreciate; If people like Harry and Feingold and Boxer and Conyers and Byrd and lots of etceteras, weren’t having an influence, we would be attacking the whole Axis of Evil by now, fully engaged in a global war, and anyone from the middle class or lower would be draft bait.
But you don’t see that as enough, you expect the Democrats to just wave their magic wand and make it all better, just the way you imagine it should be.
However, I do join you in your call for the answers to your questions, I have never questioned your logic or reasoning in asking them. You just use a lot of poison vernacular in the way you ask, and you make demands that none of our elected officials, except those Republicans in control, can satisfy. And they aren’t going to listen to you, in your anger, or me in my logic, in the first place, so why are you so mad at Harry?
Might it be, the victory he speaks of is removing our troops safely, as soon as possible? But to frame it that way, so people like you are satiated, brings down the same type of BS we got last time, where Murtha’s strategic 6 month withdrawal plans were perverted on the floor of Congress into “cut and run immediately.”
Even those of us who want out NOW, right now, the Cindy Sheehan kind of NOW, don’t expect that to happen, even though it is the right thing to do.
I’m nobody’s apologist, but I am loyal when I choose my sides. If you can’t find a side to choose in this political divide, you’re just flailing in the wind. Anyone who thinks the Democrats and the Republicans are equal in this disaster is using simplistic reasoning.
Obviously, you never understood what I meant when I said a lot of good Democrats feel exactly the way you do, but very few Republicans would agree with you at any level.
So who are your allies?
Lets stop dealing with one another and deal with the “other side” of this equation. If you’ll go over to one of the Bush Blogs and make the same arguments you are making here, I’ll believe you. But for now, I can’t tell which side you are really on, because according to you, everyone who doesn’t respond with your sense of imminent urgency is the enemy.
JEP
— John Patterson Dec 19, 03:43 PM # - An open letter to George W. Bush;
Victory” didn’t work, now we’re “losers” if we leave?
That seems to be the new line, the latest talking point, the diametric opposite of Victory is Loser.
No more of this “Victory” BS, lets talk “losers.” That Victory as a “keyword” thing wasn’t working, huh?
I would appreciate it if any of our trolls could describe for us how we can possibly lose this war?
Lay out the scenario for us.
If the Iraqis have a civil war, have we lost? Or if the Iraqis control their own oil profits, do we lose? If Iran ends up ruling Iraq, are we the losers? Or will it be our old enemies the Sunnis who would be the losers? Or Are we both, Americans and Sunnis, the losers then?
What constitutes losing?
Dead soldiers and civilians?
Here’s a thought: Maybe, as long as we are there, George still has a chance to lose this war and fail to supplant Daddy as “The Greater of Two Bushes.”
Just how can we lose this war, now with Saddam in a monkey cage and the regime completely changed?
George W. Bush, please tell us, apparently you know.
JEP
— John Patterson Dec 19, 03:58 PM # - ANWR, Haliburton’s next no-bid playground, just got the big screwjob from Congress.
In the same bill that includes military pay raises and limitations on torture. Made it real hard to vote against ANWR. Now anyone who defends the environment by voting agsinst anwr is labeled a traitor who won’t support the troops and won’t vote against torture.
Was that the deal McCain made? Oil for torture?
Get the drills out, boys, there’s oil in them thar’ hills!
Alaska’s residents should all hope the drillers provide some cheap petroleum jelly, along with the easy cash.
HYPOCRITES!!!
What is the ANWR bill doing in the same bill with the torture restrictions?
GREEDY HYPOCRITES!!!!
JEP
— John Patterson Dec 19, 04:26 PM # - “I have always wanted the answers to those questions. But I don’t expect them to come in the form of paragraphs and sentences. The results will show up in ways you might not see, especially if you expect easy answers from people like Harry, who’s only hope for influence is to play a game of political chess you could never understand.”
Don’t throw that condescending bullshit at me. I understand PERFECTLY what you are saying. You are saying that politics takes precedence over honesty and common sense. I understand political horseshit when I see it, and that is EXACTLY what Reid is casting with that embarrasing bit of nothingness he starts this thread with. And yes, your rationale and justifications for such meaningless political posturing ARE the actions of an apologist.
— Pissed Off American Dec 19, 04:28 PM # - Shouldn’t the signature be, “The GOP won’t get over it?”
— John Patterson Dec 19, 04:36 PM # - An open letter to George W. Bush;
Victory” didn’t work, now we’re “losers” if we leave?
.......yadayadayada….
George W. Bush, please tell us, apparently you know.
JEP
— John Patterson
ROFLMAO!!!!!! And you question my efforts to wrest answers out of the one man who is supposed to be spearheading the opposition to Bush, as the “Minority Leader”???
Tell me, who here has the strongest chance of recieving an answer, and is pursuing the most constructive avenue for change?
Talk about tilting at windmills.
John, I think you are just another partisan fool, who has been sold party loyalty at the cost of common sense and self-determination.
Wise up, you damned fool, if your generals won’t wage battle, you will never win the war. We are represented by eunichs and opportunists, and it is time we demanded more. Bush and Cheney are walking all over these cowards, and the kind of mincing rhetoric we see at the head of this thread is the PROBLEM, not the solution.
— Pissed Off American Dec 19, 04:42 PM # - http://rawstory.com/news/2005/Democrats_plan_sharp_rebuke_of_prewar_1219.html
— bill_o_carolina Dec 19, 04:52 PM # - — Jesus was a LIBERAL! Dec 19, 09:06 AM #
Total stupidity, Would Jesus have agreed with the liberals and authorized the murder of 1.4 million innocent unborn children every year in America? Would Jesus have approved the starvation for a half of a month of a disabled Terri Schindler? I could go on for a book but you get the idea. Read a bible and the DNC Platform and than make your asinine statement.
— joro Dec 19, 05:00 PM # - “You are saying that politics takes precedence over honesty and common sense.”
I’m saying exactly that, over and over again, in nearly every post I have ever pecked out.
And not because I like it. Because it is a fact, and a sad one indeed.
You want a revolutionary change in the way we govern, or maybe a stricter adherance to the ideals that came from our Revolution.
I agree. But I am a realist.
You still think your revolutionary needs can be met with evolutionary Democracy, and I’m trying to tell you your only source of influence, outside of outright rebellion, is to pick a side and live with it, and do whatever you can to bend that side towards the ends you seek.
True, there are more people every day who get that urge for rebellion, and maybe they are right.
Being right doesn’t necessarily make you powerful, at least not at this stage in our evolutionary trip.
DO THE BEST WITH WHAT YOU HAVE.
JEP
— John Patterson Dec 19, 05:03 PM # - Thanks for the link, Bill.
John, Reid’s name better be on this thing, or your apologies for him are going to fall on deaf ears…....
Democrats plan sharp rebuke of pre-war intelligence, Iraq war in massive new congressional report
Larisa Alexandrovna and John Byrne
House Judiciary Committee Democrats, spearheaded by Congressman John Conyers (D-MI), are set to release possibly the sharpest congressional critique to date surrounding Iraq, RAW STORY has learned.
The report, titled “The Constitution in Crisis: The Downing Street Minutes and Deception, Manipulation, Torture, Retribution and Coverups in the Iraq War,” is slotted to be made available to the public Tuesday. RAW STORY acquired a copy of the book’s cover and some additional information about the document today.
According to Democratic aides, the report will focus on alleged manipulation of pre-war intelligence by the White House, specifically covering such topics as the Downing Street Minutes as well as the White House position on the Geneva Conventions and international law as regards its policies toward prisoners of war. Sources say the report is slated to be published as a book.
continues at…...
http://rawstory.com/news/2005/Democrats_plan_sharp_rebuke_of_prewar_1219.html
— Pissed Off American Dec 19, 05:07 PM # - John, I think Pissed Off American has got you with #73. There isn’t a breath of leadership coming out of Reid, Pelosi, Dean, or any Congressional Dem. Too bad the pathetic clowns who call themselves Senators from my state of Illinois aren’t up for re-election. They’ve shown just as much competence.
Maybe Daschle should roll out the Welcome Wagon, as he knows all about Dem “leadership”.
— Steve Dec 19, 05:08 PM # - Jesus believed in feeding the poor, free medical care and sharing of resources. And the only Republican-type he ever encountered, except for maybe Pilate, He told him to sell all he had and give to the poor, and come and follow Him.
The rich man just couldn’t do it, because his wealth mattered more.
So, Joro, you ready to sell all you have and give it to the poor?
How about you conservative icons? How many of their daughters had those abortions you mentioned, because they didn’t want to be pregnant their freshman year at Vassar?
HYPOCRITES!!
joro, read up on the Pharisees, because I’ll give you a lesson on them next time you mention The Lord in vain. You oppose abortion but you defend torture, and then you pretend to speak for God?
You are in for a real big surprise.
JEP
— John Patterson Dec 19, 05:11 PM # - As for all of you who think the Dems aren’t displaying leadership, let me repeat a paragraph none of you seems to want to address.
“Here’s an example you should appreciate; If people like Harry and Feingold and Boxer and Conyers and Byrd and lots of etceteras, weren’t having an influence, we would be attacking the whole Axis of Evil by now, fully engaged in a global war, and anyone from the middle class or lower would be draft bait.”
I wonder how many of your college age trolls would still be boosting bush and blasting harry if you were facing boot camp and deployment to a big battle in North Korea or Iran?
You all know the neocons wanted to attack everyone in the axis, but something held them back from outright world-wide engagement.
I wonder who was involved in that?
JEP
— John Patterson Dec 19, 05:16 PM # - # 49. One of the biggest complaints I have ever had about President Bush is his secrecy, fortunately for all of us he seems to have given up some ground on this issue.
JJ Glendenning
— JJ Glendenning Dec 19, 12:09 PM #
Who hired Craig Livingstone? Where were the billing records for 4 years? Who fired the Travel Office employees? Did they ever find the 2 guns Vince Foster used to blow his brains out with? What were the raw FBI files used for? Who used them?
— joro Dec 19, 05:16 PM # - “You still think your revolutionary needs can be met with evolutionary Democracy, and I’m trying to tell you your only source of influence, outside of outright rebellion, is to pick a side and live with it, and….
DO WHATEVER YOU CAN TO BEND THAT SIDE TOWARDS THE ENDS YOU SEEK.”
Great idea, John. When do you intend to start?
— Pissed Off American Dec 19, 05:20 PM # - # 55 Patterson. Start adding up the indictments, the charges and allegations and investigations, and there is clearly an implosion going on in America’s ruling party, and it is not foreign terrorists who are creating it, unless Osama has been hiding on K Street.
I will match indictments and convictions of the Clinton’s and compare them to the current honest, moral administration any day of the week. The Democrat Clinton’s were the most crooked, corrupt, lying administration in our history so stop with your lies already. The Democrat party is the one that imploded so that now Republicans control the White House, The US Senate, The US House, most state legislatures and most State governorships. That trend will continue because of obstructionists like the sore loser Reid being a party hack who kills important legislation for his perceived filthy political purposes. In the process, Reid puts American lives at risk.
RECALL REID.
— joro Dec 19, 05:30 PM # - #52 POA
The trolls (troll) here are (is) attempting to “jam” the threads with this bullshit they are casting. I strongly suggest you attempt to IGNORE the more obvious inanities they are offering as distractions. As much as I am disgusted by Reid’s mewling comment and his unwillingness to go beyond the opportunistic grandstanding we saw in his Senate Charade, the RW propaganda machine must be intimidated by him, or they would not be trolling this site with such fervor. If you continue to engage these assholes they will literally destroy this website. Again, I suggest you ignore them.
POA, try being an American for a day instead of a partisan hack. You might find you enjoy it and begin doing what is best for America rather than parroting the DNC propaganda.
GIVE HARRY HELL.
— joro Dec 19, 05:34 PM # - Sometimes I think public rebellion is what the neocons and Bush are hoping for and trying to encite. Then they could declare marshall law and all investigations of their corruption would be ceased.
— bill_o_carolina Dec 19, 05:35 PM # - POA, it won’t be long and your only allies will be people like Steve.
I’ve been following Conyers’ story since the Ohio election, this should be a good example to you of how laboriously the wheels of justice turn in a bully government. I still have a very early copy of Conyer’s DVD “Rove’s War” which I show to people as often as possible.
But don’t you realize, Conyers has taken one baby step after another towards this event, we tried to get it out to the public long ago, but “The Powers That BE’ that you seem to consider non-existent (and therefore you should get your way on demand) sent us into a basement room and the MSM refused to continue covering the living story, except for CSpan and then only at first..
Conyers has had to scratch and scrape for every inch of ground he has taken to get this far. So are you getting on his blog and trashing him for playing the waiting game he has no choice but to play, and staying with it through thick and thin, until he can finally make a difference?
If Conyers’ people are your allies, so is Harry Reid.
If you think Harry can do so much moremore, why don’t you describe just what you think he has the power to do?
If it comes down to trashing the President more vocally and with greater vehemence, well, he’s got us to do that for him. About all he can do that would satisfy you is to trash Bush publicly using your harsh vernacular.
But other than that, just what powers do you think he has at his disposal that he isn’t using?
Like I said, I’ve watched Conyer’s Downing Street Memo program crawl along inch by labored inch for months and months, and never once accused John Conyers of being responsible for slowing it down. You sure seem bent on blaming Harry when he hits a wallnot of his own making.
So who’s side are you on? Just give me a reference of at least one political figure you trust enough to call worthy?
JEP
— John Patterson Dec 19, 05:37 PM # - joro, joro, is it back to Clinton again? Why are so many republicans jealous of Bill Clinton? He’s history, get over it.
— bill_o_carolina Dec 19, 05:42 PM # - “Here’s an example you should appreciate; If people like Harry and Feingold and Boxer and Conyers and Byrd and lots of etceteras, weren’t having an influence, we would be attacking the whole Axis of Evil by now, fully engaged in a global war, and anyone from the middle class or lower would be draft bait.”
Oh come on. Thats like the argument that the right is offering that Bush has averted another terrorist attack. You offer hypotheticals as excuses for reality. I have seen no partisan tug of war in regards to the escalation of Bush’s imperialism in the Middle east. Circumstance and poor planning caused the derailment of the Neocon designs on Iraq, Syria and Iran. And we are not out of the woods yet. The Israelis would like nothing more than to see our efforts expand, and they are definitely not beyond triggering an event that would mandate such an expansion.
You know John, the weak opposition that has been advanced by the Democratic party’s leadership works perfectly in the favor of these lying treasonous bastards in the White House. You have had the umittigated gall to question my motives and my alliances here, while you defend the very weaknesses that have allowed this Administration to enjoy the excesses of power it currently practices. One wonders, how, after the 5 years of ineffective and counterproductive efforts that the Democratic leadership has lodged, you can defend the status quo and seriously advance the argument that we are making inroads…...PARTICULARLY when we see the mewling horseshit that Reid offers above, directly on the heels of the revelation that Bush is illegally spying on American citizens.
We MUST ignite the passions of the leaders of the so called “opposition party” with the sparks of our disillusionment and dissappointment if we expect to turn this mess around. One wonders why you have armed yourself with a fire extinguisher instead of a blow torch.
— Pissed Off American Dec 19, 05:44 PM # - 1. Now that we’ve had 9/11, capturing OBL should have been the # 1 priority without any questions. Before 9/11, there was some room for debate. But not now! So why hasn’t Bush caught him?
2. Bush and his administration had been warned by the outgoing administration that OBL and AQ was the biggest threat and they pretty much ignored them which may not completely let the Clinton administration off the hook… but mostly off the hook.
3. The Clinton administration did try both diplomacy AND force to capture or kill OBL well before it was politically popular to do so.
— bill_o_carolina Dec 19, 05:47 PM # - “You sure seem bent on blaming Harry when he hits a wall not of his own making.”
Again, I point towards the bit of useless horseshit that Reid offered above. Care to tell me what purpose it served?
“Wall not of his own making” my ass.
— Pissed Off American Dec 19, 05:50 PM # - Joro’s last post;
“I will match indictments and convictions of the Clinton’s and compare them to the current honest, moral administration any day of the week.”
Post that anywhere but Blogs for Bush and you will have them laughing in the aisles. Clinton, the magic word!
Just say “Clinton” and the argument is won!
I’m gonna frame this one and hang it somewhere in public.
“CURRENT HONEST, MORAL ADMINISTRATION”?
HYPOCRITES!!!
Just saying it can’t make it true, you are only reinforcing the brainwashing you have suffered. There is no way history will ever compare Clinton’s indescretions to Bush’s deadly deceptions, but you can fool yourself all day if you want. Just don’t try to post any proof, ayou’re wasting our time and blogspace.
I’m going to post that paragraph in public place, then stand back and watch. I’ll do a video of the response from people on the street, and put it on the website.
This should be good.
JEP
— John Patterson Dec 19, 05:50 PM # - If the officer in charge of the train had been Japanese instead of british, what would have happened to Ghandi?
— Walter E. Wallis Dec 19, 05:51 PM # - #67 POA. You said to the wannabe neolib troll, Patterson “BTW, why are you pimping for Reid? Why not use this blog to implore him to answer the three simple questions I pose here in my opening comment on this thread? Does he REQUIRE an apologist? Join me in seeking a response to my simple questions. Whats the harm?
— Pissed Off American Dec 19, 02:53 PM #
I like your definition of what Demmie sheeple are doing. The DNC controlled main street media is doing the same for the Democrats. Thank God radicals like Patterson obviously have no influence on the informed voter at election time. What you are asking Patterson to do is what we Republicans have done for decades. We demand honesty and integrity of our politicians and if they go astray, we quickly remove them as we did recently to Cunningham. Contrast that to Reid who recently praised the self confessed Grand Kleagle Robert KKK Byrd from the Senate floor on national TV!!!
GIVE HARRY HELL
— joro Dec 19, 05:54 PM # - #68. Lets stop dealing with one another and deal with the “other side” of this equation. If you’ll go over to one of the Bush Blogs and make the same arguments you are making here, I’ll believe you. But for now, I can’t tell which side you are really on, because according to you, everyone who doesn’t respond with your sense of imminent urgency is the enemy.
JEP
— John Patterson Dec 19, 03:43 PM #
There is the problem. You, and the Democrats, including your leaders, see this as a contest between political parties. We Republicans see the issue as doing what is best for America. That is why Republicans are in control and sore losers like Reid are crying in their whine soup.
GIVE HARRY HELL
— joro Dec 19, 06:00 PM # - POA;
It served the same purpose John Conyer’s blog has served for many months, and many other blogs, to keep the issue burning and not letting it drop off the map. One day at a time, one paragraph at a time.
Harry can’t make it all right in a single paragraph But if you look at the pattern, not the posting itself, it is just like Conyers and everyone else who is fighting these bullies.
Again, what do you think Harry can do, more than this? Please answer this one question, what more should he do?
What tools does he have that you think he is not using?
If you just want him to talk dirty or trash Bush personally, you just don’t get it. Here’s a clip from Harry’s post.
”...too much of the substance remains the same and the American people have still not heard what benchmarks we must meet along the way to know that progress is being made and that our brave troops can begin to come home.”
Does that sound like he’s kissing Bushbutt?
You want us all to think so.
Sounds more like an admonition to me, but apparently because there are no expletives included, you think Harry’s not doing his job.
You want it to read, “Bush is a lyin’ sack of cow manure, and he’s not tellin’ us the truth about what he’s a schemin’ for our troops…”
Sounds good for a screenplay, but unless it’s Cheney talking to Leahy, the language will obviously remain much too over-civilized for your tastes.
JEP
— John Patterson Dec 19, 06:06 PM # - #71 Your response to Patterson “Don’t throw that condescending bullshit at me. I understand PERFECTLY what you are saying. You are saying that politics takes precedence over honesty and common sense. I understand political horseshit when I see it, and that is EXACTLY what Reid is casting with that embarrasing bit of nothingness he starts this thread with. And yes, your rationale and justifications for such meaningless political posturing ARE the actions of an apologist.
— Pissed Off American Dec 19, 04:28 PM # ”
BINGO. POA, you sometimes make the most sense of any Demmie ever.
RECALL REID.
— joro Dec 19, 06:06 PM # - John, the line about heading off the draft by the “leaders” you mention can be dismissed outright since nobody except a Democrat (Rangel, in a political stunt) has even talked about a draft. Only you guys do.
How do you know we’d be attacking the entire Axis of Evil all at once? Do you have some military insight into this? Some contact at the DoD give you a tip? I didn’t know the neocons wanted to do this attacking all at once. As far as who held them back, my guess is the administration itself and those in Congress who know more about defense matters than just appropriations for their district.
Hey, how about that assassination attempt on Ahmadinejad? Are you going to blame the “neocon cabal”?
— Steve Dec 19, 06:06 PM # - The U.S. versus the World.
Joro’s view of reality.
And a nightmare for us if it ever really happens.
JEP
— John Patterson Dec 19, 06:07 PM # - POA;
See what I told you about the trolls taking your side?
By your own extremity, you are one with them.
JEP
— John Patterson Dec 19, 06:09 PM # - #80. I wonder how many of your college age trolls would still be boosting bush and blasting harry if you were facing boot camp and deployment to a big battle in North Korea or Iran?— John Patterson Dec 19, 05:16 PM